Collision at the start. 2 boats involved

[Jeffrey LePageParticipant]

In the starting sequence and at the start.
2 boats involved:

• Boat 1 Barging and Boat 2 protecting his space
• Boat 1 Definitely Barging
• Boat 2 not trying to avoid contact
• Protest flags flown
• No protest filed
• I don’t thing any circles were performed.

—I think the RC should have protested both boats because the contact was obvious and strong
—Both boats finished in the middle of the fleet
—If the RC protest were executed, I believe both boats would have been penalized with at least DNS.

[WebmasterAdministrator]

Per the SI, the protest filing time limit is 45 minutes after the R/C docks. See RRS 61.3 and SI 17.3. So, if there is no filing within the time limit, then there can be no protest. However, the PC, under 61.3 is obligated to extend the filing time if there is good reason to do so, but I think extending the time is the PC’s call to make.

—I think the RC should have protested both boats because the contact was obvious and strong

I would say don’t put it on the R/C’s shoulders to file a protest. Any boat competing in the race that witnessed the incident can file a protest. See RRS 60.1.a.

So, once another boat learns there was not a protest filed, that boat has a little time to file a protest regarding that incident. Standard RRS time limit would be 2 hours, but maybe in this case that might be limited to the 45 minute window stated in the Fleet 27 SI.

—If the RC protest were executed, I believe both boats would have been penalized with at least DNS.

FYI – A decision in this type of incident would never end up awarding a scoring code of DNS to a boat that started the race.

[Jeffrey LePageParticipantParticipant]

Thanks Matt.

I like that any boat that witnessed the incident could protest and taking the heat off the RC.

How would Boats 1 and 2 be scored if both boats were tossed?

[WebmasterAdministrator]

How would Boats 1 and 2 be scored if both boats were tossed?

They would each get a DSQ. But, unless the collision caused more than superficial damage, it is likely that one of the boats would be exonerated for the collision. One of them is likely at fault, but hard to tell which one without the evidence.

I am not sure if rule A5.3 is in effect, or not, this year. If A5.3 is not in effect this year, then DNS and DSQ are the same number of points. If A5.3 is in effect as it has been in past years, then DSQ usually ends up being more points than DNS, depending on the number of boats in the series and how many of them are DNC for that night.

[Chris MorinParticipant]

1. Would it be DSQ ?

 

2. If another boat protests the two for not protesting, can the boats involved in the incident file a protest before the time limit or accept fault and receive a penalty ?

3. If this is possible is it a % penalty ?

4. How does arbitration work ?

[WebmasterAdministrator]

If there was serious damage or injury, AFAIK, the only scoring options are DSQ or RET (i.e., the at-fault boat could retire before the protest meeting starts). And both could be DSQ’d if both are found at fault for different rules (i.e., RRS11 and RRS14).

If no serious damage or injury, then arbitration might be held before the protest meeting, and the at-fault boat could accept an alternate scoring penalty (30%, per RRS V2).

Per RRS 44.3, at the time of the foul and there is no serious damage or injury, the at fault boat could hoist a yellow flag to accept a 20% penalty, rather than do a circle. I have never seen this done, have you?

I don’t think your #2 issue really matters. Someone needs to file a protest to get the ball rolling. I don’t think it really matters who that is. The 3rd party protest is for the actual incident, not for 1 (or both) of the 2 boats “not protesting.” No one is required to file a protest. But, if there is an incident, then anyone who saw it can file a protest.

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